In this conversation, Cathy shares her path to ultimately finding lasting sobriety through online recovery communities, books, podcasts, and daily practice. She reflects on the importance of connection, the reality that recovery looks different for everyone, and why it’s never too late to begin again.
Cathy’s story offers hope, honesty, and practical encouragement.
Key Takeaways
- Recovery is rarely linear. Cathy’s lasting sobriety came after many attempts, not one perfect decision.
- Community matters. Online recovery groups, books, and digital support became essential parts of her journey.
- Recovery looks different for everyone. AA works for many people, while others thrive through digital communities and alternative recovery paths.
- Playing the story forward helps break cravings by focusing on tomorrow rather than the first drink.
- Progress matters more than perfection. Every sober day is valuable, even after setbacks.
- Push off from here.” No matter where you are today, recovery can begin now.
Memorable Quotes
- “You can always push off from here”
- “Life is hard. Drinking just makes it worse”
- “Every sober day is a blessing”
- “Connection with others redminds you that you’re not alone”
Transcript
Introductions and Growing Up in an Alcoholic Family
Conor: Welcome to the IYWI interview series where we explore recovery connections and the conversations that help people build meaningful and lasting sobriety.
My name is Conor Evers and I am part of the team here at IYWI. IYWI stands for “if you work it.” It’s a completely free mobile app that you can download on the App Store or Google Play.
And today we have a fantastic guest, Cathy E., who is someone I have looked up to a lot in my own personal recovery journey. Well, Aunt Cathy, welcome to the interview series. To start, if you could maybe give us a brief overview just of who you are and what your connection to recovery is, that would be great.
Cathy: Sure. Well, it’s been a long journey for me for sure. I’m 59, just turned 59.
I grew up with severe alcoholism. My dad was, God bless him – I’ve forgiven him and I understand him now – but he was a binge drinker.
So he could go months and life seemed normal. And then he would go on a binge and life would be destroyed. Crashing cars, losing jobs, punching walls. You know, a lot of the walls in our upstairs bedroom at home had fists punched through them. Luckily, he never hurt any of us physically, so that was a good thing.
I started therapy when I was in high school but I didn’t really realize it. I had a high school guidance counselor who, now that I’m an adult and my kids went through school, I realized probably they knew what was going on at home even though I didn’t think the world knew.
And he helped me tremendously. I actually started, in high school group I worked with a group that was against drunk driving, Students Against Drunk Driving it was called. We made a video. So, probably didn’t even realize what I was doing at the time, but I started really (therapy) early.
Went to college – didn’t really drink much in high school. I was a perfect example of the kid who doesn’t drink a whole lot. Perfect little high school student – went to college and let loose and drank way too much.
I think back on it – in fact, I was just at Colby this weekend. Jim and I stopped by – and I thought to myself, “Wow, I had some really embarrassing moments here.”
And then got married, had kids. I was very pure in my pregnancies and my raising the kids. I actually didn’t drink at all.
And then as the kids got older, actually as they went to college, I started with that one glass of wine on the weekends and then it was Saturday, then it was Sunday, then it was Monday through Friday, then it was two glasses, then it was three glasses and then truthfully gosh turned into a freaking bottle of wine a night. And it was wine-30. And I worked so hard. And you know got crazy and embarrassing.
And I one day googled “am I an alcoholic?” And you know when you Google that, you probably have a relationship problem with alcohol.
Conor, that was like 15 years ago. Maybe 12. It took me that long (to finally get sober) and I’ve been sober now for three, four years.
I had a lot of starts and stops honestly. Like a lot of starts and stops. To the point where I stopped counting.
“I had a lot of starts and stops honestly. Like a lot of starts and stops. To the point where I stopped counting.”
And when I stopped counting and gave myself a little bit of a break is when I quit for good. It’s been at least maybe four years coming up on four or five. Yep. That’s it. And here I am.
And at first I was embarrassed. I don’t want people am I the like drunk under the under the bridge with a paper bag? No, I was never that. In fact, when I tell people I quit drinking, a lot of people are like, “Did you have a problem?” And like like I had a personal problem that maybe it wasn’t outward, but it certainly was a problem to me.
And it started to become a problem with my relationships. You know, texts that I forgot I sent, conversations I forgot I had, an empty bottle of wine that I’d find hidden behind a plant.
I think back and it’s so embarrassing and I’m I’m so grateful had Uncle Jim – you know, my husband Jim – was understanding and he loves me so much that he gave me the second chances and I quit.
And it wasn’t easy. I started and stopped. And I’m so grateful. I am so grateful that I quit. I’ve told you before, I consider myself a “lucky one” now.
I was one of those people that would say, “You’re so lucky. You get you get to drink.” And then it was Laura McKowen and she has a sobriety program. She’s based out of Boston. I read one of her books and I joined her club called “The Luckiest Club” is online sobriety.
And at first I didn’t understand “the Luckiest Club.” I thought it was the stupidest name. And once I got sober and I now I tell people I’m lucky. I’m so lucky that I’ve discovered my life without alcohol and I love that life.
It’s not perfect. There’s lots of problems, but my life without alcohol – I’m just lucky that I figured out how to quit.
The Importance of Community in Recovery
Conor: It’s amazing. Yeah. Being able to find a community, digitally, is really special. I’m curious about that time in your in your journey. Was there like a specific moment when you were thinking about getting sober or starting to get sober that you realized, I probably can’t do this alone. I’m going to need some sort of community or other people to help me on this journey.
Cathy: Yeah, 100%. Because of all the starts and stops. And all the times I said, “Oh, I can have just one.” Oh, yeah. That just one was never ever just one for me. It would the dopamine would hit my brain. I would feel it.
Here’s the challenge for drinkers or addicts of any kind. That dopamine hit for the first 20 minutes. That makes you feel good. And that does make you feel good. That’s not a lie. That’s true.
And it’s realizing that yeah, that turns into utter chaos and destruction when that when that wears off and then you go for the second one and the third one and then you’re uninhibited and then you’re a mess and then you do things you regret.
And you know so for me it was the starts and the stops. I love audio books and podcasts and I started with some audio books from women who started online sobriety. I think there are probably pioneers in online sobriety.
Hollywood Whitaker as one and she wrote a book “Quit Like a Woman” and Holly was partners with Laura McKowen, that’s how I learned about the Luckiest Club and boy Laura McKowen wrote a book about being being a lucky one, and anyway so I started listening to audio books, and just connecting to the stories and realizing oh wow other women are going through what I’m going through
And that connection of realizing, okay I’m not the biggest loser on the planet. There’re a lot of people that have the exact same story. You think you’re unique. It was every time that I realized something I thought was unique to me and my unhealthy relationship to alcohol that I realized someone else said the same thing that I realized, okay, I need to talk to those people. I need that community.
And so I just started devouring – what do they call it? – quit lit? I devoured the quit lit.
“Okay I’m not the biggest loser on the planet. There’re a lot of people that have the exact same story.”
I’m sort of a logical person. So William Porter’s “Alcohol Explained,” but I listen to that on repeat. There are certain chapters that I would just listen to over and over and over and it helped me understand, wow, my body has a physical dependency on this horrible toxic poison. And it made me feel better. It made me realize I’m not alone and I need help.
And I did online sobriety. Conor, I was not going to be the one that went to a church basement. My dad did that. My dad tried that. And I love that that foundation was there for people and still is there for people. I just knew I wasn’t going to go and do that.
So the online sobriety programs and the audio books, all of that stuff helped me tremendously.
Find Out What Works for You
Conor: Yeah, there really are a significant amount of resources outside of the typical, going to AA for your entire life. That’s something that’s worked for me. The meetings, the community, the experience that I get out of that, especially, having the majority of my experience in AA being in LA, which is a really special place, it’s worked a lot. But, I remember spending a lot of time in those environments early on when I just I think like you had really no interest in that being my recovery experience. And all it really did was build resentment.
I think back to that time and maybe if I had leaned into a digital recovery resource or, maybe found something else that wasn’t AA right off the bat, I don’t know if things would look different or my story would be any different, but I think it is important to acknowledge that there are a variety of different ways to achieve lasting sobriety,
Cathy: A whole spectrum, and a big part of it is the whole community part. I don’t think any of us totally understand how important that is because we’re embarrassed and afraid to reach out at first, but I imagine you’re like me where some of your most meaningful, deepest connected relationships are now with other people who have gone through what you’ve gone through and are also sober on the other side.
Conor: 100%. If I’m honest, I think it’s probably 90% of the people that I communicate with on a regular basis are people that I have met on my recovery journey. And it’s really important for me, because if I don’t surround myself with people on the same path, I can get distracted. And immediate family are people that drink alcohol and, I I can spend time around them, but if I didn’t have people in my life to keep me in line and to bounce ideas off or my feelings, it might be difficult for me to be in some of those environments.
Cathy: Remember, I come from an alcohol-centric family also. Honestly, what feels kind of good is, since I quit, I feel like there’s a lot less drinking at my family gatherings as well.
But oh boy, yeah, a lot of alcohol-centric events and to the point where, when I first quit, I was nervous to go. And I would listen to one of my quit lit audio books all the way down to Connecticut and it helped give me the strengths and the reminders. Honestly, it’s the reminders of “break the routine,” “you don’t have to do that.”
One of the things that Laura McKowen would do is she would say: “Tell yourself the story. You have you have two paths tonight. You drink or you don’t drink.
What does it look like if you drink? You have I one glass, two glasses, three glasses. Now you’re drunk and throwing up somewhere and you don’t know what you said to your kid and you said something horrible to your mother. And you wake up and you’re hung over and you can’t go for that run with your daughter that you promised her in the morning and you’re in a fog and you hate yourself essentially.
Okay, what about the other path? What if you don’t drink? Okay, I have a glass of seltzer. I have that first awkward moment when my sister-in-law runs in and offers me a glass of wine and I say, “No, why aren’t you drinking?” “Well, I just don’t want to.” and then they go on and drink.
What you realize is when you’re around people who drink, once they’re drinking they kind of don’t care what you’re doing anymore, and they don’t notice that you’ve just had a gallon of seltzer water with lemon and lime. And then I have meaningful conversations with people who aren’t drinking.
And also – you know what I realized, Conor? – I thought everybody was as drunk as me at all these events. And then I kind of realized, oh my god, they’re not. Not everybody is. And there’s a lot of people to have a nice, meaningful conversation with that aren’t drinking. So boy that that whole world.
And then you go to bed early and you wake up early and you go for that run with your daughter and you have a wonderful day and you’re proud of yourself and you love yourself. And those are the stories I kept clinging to.
That’s what I want my Sunday morning to look like is a clear head 5:00 a.m., sun in my face, outdoors, with the fresh air walking or running or you know whatever I was doing at the time. So that kind of kind of thing really, really helped me.
It’s Normal to Fear a Sober Life
Conor: It’s amazing. I’m curious what you know when I think about my experience in early recovery there were a lot of challenges that I went through. For you maybe what was the hardest part”
For me, I had a really difficult time thinking “how am I going to do this for the rest of my life?” How am I going to not drink? Today I don’t think that way. I take it more as a one-day-at-a-time approach, which is a common theme in AA. To embrace that mindset. But I’m curious if there were any struggles early on that made it difficult to go on the sobriety journey.
Cathy: We glamorize the drinking, and I’m not going to lie, I did have fun. I did have fun moments when I was drinking before it became problem drinking, right? So, if I could have one or two glasses of wine and just get a little buzzy and a little silly and maybe sing a song I wouldn’t sing or dance a little harder than I would.
But what happened for me is that just didn’t stay that way. It got progressively worse and progressively more chaotic and progressively uglier.
To your question, I did worry about I’m not going to be fun anymore. No one’s gonna like me anymore. How can you possibly go to a concert and not drink? I honestly thought to myself, how can how can I possibly do that?
And one of my first sober concerts was Bruce Springsteen at Fenway Park and I went with Uncle Jimmy.
“I did worry about I’m not going to be fun anymore. No one’s gonna like me anymore. How can you possibly go to a concert and not drink? I honestly thought to myself, how can how can I possibly do that?”
I’ll tell you, I am fortunate. I am fortunate that my husband has never needed to drink and has never drank. I used to joke – and I was proud of myself of this joke and now it’s dumb – “Oh, I drink and he drives.”
But it’s kind of true. He would never drink too much. And I’m grateful for that. And I do realize I’m lucky for that.
There’s a lot of relationships where the relationship is based on the two drinking together. And if one quits and the other doesn’t, sometimes the relationship has to end.
You’re a young man. You weren’t married. You didn’t have to end a relationship. But my guess is you had to end friendships that were based on drinking.
Sometimes we do 100% have to say goodbye to old relationships. And I like to think they’re not meaningless in your life. And you don’t have to hate those people, but if they detract from your sobriety and your progress, you do have to say goodbye to some relationships and change some relationships.
And sometimes those people are proud of you and can handle it and stay in the relationship even if they continue to drink three glasses of wine by your side and you’re drinking your seltzer water. And sometimes it doesn’t work out. I’m lucky.
So back to the Bruce Springsteen concert at Fenway Park. Jim didn’t care to go get a beer
Honestly, with every success, I built my own strength. And I realized I can do it.
We went to a Jelly Roll concert in Bangor. That’s why we stopped at Colby College on our way home from Bangor the other night. And I remember thinking to myself, wow, I didn’t even think for a split second, am I going to drink tonight? And I am all so grateful that I’m that far into my sobriety that I don’t even think about it.
And I don’t think anymore, how am I going to enjoy this concert? Now I actually enjoy the concert because I hear every song and I know everything that happened.
Unlike, when I was younger, my goodness, I went to concerts in my college years where I don’t even remember the damn concert. What a waste that is. You’re going to see some group that you love and you don’t even remember the damn show. Like, that’s stupid, right?
I definitely 100% had all the reservations and the fears. It’s weird that it’s fearful to quit. Like in retrospect, I think, well, you’re quitting a toxic substance that was poisoning your body and your life. What was there to fear?
But the fear is “How am I going to enjoy my life? Am I going to have fun? Are people still going to like me? And am I still going to be fun?
And you know the answer is yeah a lot better. It’s a lot better. But you it’s a journey. It’s not easy. I feel fortunate that I’m at this level in my recovery.
It took me 10 years. 10 years honestly of reading the books, listening to the audio books, the podcasts, the sobriety courses, everything. I had a lot of three months, six months, a year.
I quit for a whole year. I remember it was a summer night. I thought, wow, I quit for a whole year. I can have a glass of wine. I was by myself. I drank a whole damn bottle of freaking sauvignon blanc.
Ended up throwing up on the deck going, “What the heck?” I started over the next day. I probably still had a couple of stumbles after that, but that was one of the ones where I’m like, “No, you can’t.” See, see, dummy, you actually can’t do that anymore.
I had a lot of failure before I before I succeeded. And I’ll just tell anybody who’s quitting, working on quitting, the failure helps you realize what you want or don’t want in your life.
“I had a lot of failure before I before I succeeded. And I’ll just tell anybody who’s quitting, working on quitting, the failure helps you realize what you want or don’t want in your life.”
I know people go cold turkey. I think most people probably tried to quit and fail at least a couple of times before and then thankfully my brain kept telling me you just don’t want to be that person anymore. You this is not what you want. And it kept teaching me the lesson that no, you cannot have just one. That’s not you.
Is There a Phrase That Keeps You Going?
Conor: Totally relate to everything you just said which I want to touch on because my experience is a lot different than your experience.
I had my first drink when I was 16 or 17. And by 18, I was essentially an alcoholic, a daily drinker. Someone that could not stop when I started.. I was “drinking against my own will” by 18, is the way I like to describe it.
It took a long journey to finally realize that alcohol in my life was never going to get me to where I wanted to go and lead me down a healthy path. I remember sort of having that awakening moment – and all I could think about was that and because I had been introduced to, AA and different recovery resources for the first few years when my drinking got bad, but I wanted nothing to do with it.
I was convinced that this was just a phase. I’d been dealt a bad hand. It was COVID time. Things would clear up a little bit and I would be able to drink normally.
But that awakening moment I recall very clearly. Everything that has been given to me in terms of these resources is exactly what I need. And the common denominator between them was they give me community; they give me connection and ultimately someone to help me straighten out my thinking because my “best thinking” had landed me back in the same place time and time again.
I clearly could not control my life or make decisions that were going to make things better. I couldn’t do it.
So, I had to allow that mentorship. For me, it was through a sponsor at AA. It was through a sober coach, someone to help me organize my life and get me going down a good path.
This last question that I want to ask you is something that ties into to kind of what I just talked about in “my best thinking got me here.” That’s a saying that I heard pretty early on in recovery and thought it was kind of a joke? What do you mean? I can control my own life. I don’t need someone else to help me out.
Is there a certain slogan or saying that you have heard on your recovery journey that sticks with you today and that you know you constantly remind yourself of?
IYWI stands for if you work it. I think that’s a great saying because no matter what program or you know path that you’re going down, if it’s AA, if it’s if it’s not AA, you still need to put in the work. You need to work it if you want the results. Is there is there like a certain slogan or something that you carry with you?
Cathy: Well, by the way, I love the IYWI if you work it because 100% if you work it, like if you build it, they will come. If you work it, it works. And I do love your app. I love the question, did you drink? Did you drink last night? Or the daily question. It’s nice to be able to say no, no, no, no, like every day. like no no and then what are you grateful for? You know some of the thing like what made you happy today? You know the the sort of the survey questions and for me it’s I use it maybe 30 seconds a day. I do my quick questions and I think of something I was grateful for and then I’m done. But I love that and that’s that little reminder is really great. And even when I say no I don’t you know like I said I’m not really a counter but it’s nice to say no I didn’t drink. No, I didn’t drink. No, I didn’t. That like that becomes a competitive you know addiction has a lot to do with routines and again, as a 59 year-old woman, now for me I became one of those wine 30 moms you know and I I hate the marketing that glamorizes that crap because honestly it’s not great to be wine 30 when you got to help your child do their homework and go to bed or whatever you know but anyway I also try not to be self-righteous and judgy when I’ve successfully quit and I know it’s not easy for people.
But a slogan that that worked for me was – it’s again Laura McKowen, she’s with the Luckiest Club – and one of her books actually is this title it’s called “Push Off from Here.”
I read that book later on in my sobriety when I had failed a couple of times. And what she means is no matter where you are and how you feel that you’ve failed you can always push off from here. Meaning, say you had been sober for 6 months and then you had those stupid glasses of wine on the deck and drank the whole bottle and threw up and sent some stupid text to somebody or said some horrible thing to your husband before you went to bed that you don’t even remember you said.
I woke up the next morning, and I could still push off from there. I could still start to not drink that day. And so wherever you are in your journey, you can always push off from here. It doesn’t matter.
I guess, God forbid if I was to go drink tonight, tomorrow morning, I could push off from there and start over and not drink. And every sober day would still be a blessing. Sober days are blessings. When you get sober, you realize how much of a blessing a sober day is.
I’ve done a lot of the sobriety stuff, Conor, and that’s why I’m I love that you’re involved in the IYWI program because I think every single one of them is helpful.
There was one out of Australia early on, and I think it’s called Sunday Mornings or something. And it’s again that same concept of being sober on a Sunday morning as opposed to after this royal raucus Saturday night You go to bed at 2 am and you don’t sleep well and you wake up hung over. Yuck.
So yeah, I grasp on to everything and anything that works. And I think that’s important. And you you’ve said it a couple of times. And it’s a connection with others and a community with others to make sure you always know you’re not alone. And you’re not a loser. If something has gotten a grip over you, you’re a human being and you need a little help. And that’s our hardest part, right? The hardest part was accepting that maybe we did need a little help. But as soon as you accept that help, life can change.
Conor: If you are struggling, tomorrow is a new day. I really like the way that you frame that answer.
Tomorrow is a new day and it’s an opportunity to, you know, keep going down the path you want to go down.
Cathy: The other thing too, it just dawned on me too, and this isn’t necessarily related to sobriety. It’s kind of related to anything in life, as parents sometimes we want to protect our kids and so we raise them as if the world is perfect and you’re never going to get hurt. Oh my gosh.
No, life actually I’ve started telling my kids life kind of sucks and then when you have a good day, embrace it and be grateful for it because life is hard. Hard things happen every single day. And it was so easy to say, “Oh, I need a glass of wine. I had to deal with this or that.”
Well, okay. Well, something hard’s going to happen tomorrow, too. You don’t want to be hung over for that, right? And so, it’s like drinking just makes everything exponentially worse. Never solves a problem ever. Always makes it worse. And so like that’s part of a reality as addicts to accept. Yeah.
Life is actually really really really hard and bad things are going to happen to every person on this planet. Bad things happen every day. Accidents, diseases, you lose a job, whatever. Bad things happen every day. Life is far from perfect. But adding drinking on top of it just makes it worse. So I love to deal with life’s challenges. sober.
It’s a lot better to do it with a with a community with people that are going through the same thing. I’ve I’ve learned that the hard way, but once I started to embrace it, it’s an
“Bad things happen every day. Life is far from perfect. But adding drinking on top of it just makes it worse. So I love to deal with life’s challenges. sober.”
So many. And [clears throat] whatever work, whatever, if it’s one thing or a combination of things, Yep. Embrace it and and do it because it’s so worth it. It’s so worth it.
Love it. Well, that’s about all I got for you. Thank you for joining today. This has been a great discussion.
My pleasure, Conor. All right.
All right. Perfect.